並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/tw/podcast/ep-292-b%E9%9D%A2-%E6%89%93%E9%8C%AF%E5%AE%9C%E8%98%AD%E7%9A%84%E6%9C%AC%E5%90%8D-%E5%96%AE%E8%A6%AA%E5%AA%BD%E5%AA%BD%E6%AD%BB%E5%88%91%E4%BA%8B%E4%BB%B6-%E7%B5%A6%E9%AB%98%E4%B8%89%E8%81%BD%E5%8F%8B%E7%9A%84%E5%8A%A0%E6%B2%B9/id1500190593?i=1000500577363